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| Board Index » What Can We Do? | The time now is Fri May 24, 2013 2:27 am |
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Stir the Pot! | Goto page Previous 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9 Next |
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Mountaineer I'm a VIP Member of PAbucks.com!!
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Stone,
I still stand behind those words..Best dam decision i ever made is to quit hunting PA..Ive never looked back. Here's a Publicland Ohio buck..and he's the small one LOL...There's 2 my buddy is getting pics of that are alot bigger. LOL..and Ohio has no AR..LOL.  |
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Stone
 I'm a 12 point buck on this forum.
My next goal is to become a Member of the Pabucks.com Monster Buck Club.
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Mountaineer:
It's not even about the size/quality of the bucks for me. Going to deer camp was a right of passage as a boy and very special camaraderie as a man. The current management practices have completely ruined that. In the ANF where it was just magical to be there in the dead of the winter hunting with your buddies and relatives, the camps sit empty now. We busted our butt the last 4-5 years and saw a grand total of a handful of deer, I think we killed 1 deer in 4 years, and that was shear luck. The game wardens who administer this site keep trying to tell us we are all looking at it wrong........they are simply full of themselves. This is the first year since I got out of the service in 1979 that I have not bought a Pa. hunting license. |
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Mountaineer I'm a VIP Member of PAbucks.com!!
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Stone,
Our group has broken up as well...A few of us have gone to Ohio. We have built some great relations there and now i get my cabin experience in that state instead of PA. PA lost 8 good hunters in my group..we all have left for other states with much better publicland hunting. As far as the game warden on this site..well..Let me put it this way..he's the same GW that told me Bucks dont shed their velvet in August..It just goes to show how clueless the PGC is about the very game animnal they supposely are managing LOL..All i can do is laugh.  |
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Cityhunter I'm a 12 point buck on this forum.
My next goal is to become a Member of the Pabucks.com Monster Buck Club.
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I agree with points #1 and #2, but I just started hunting 2 years ago and I've seen deer everytime I've went out except for maybe 3 over the past 2 years. And I went hunting at least 20 times last year. 95 % was bow hunting, so I didn't get a shot most days. But I still see a lot of deer out there. I mostly hunt around Pittsburgh though. So I don't have much experience in other areas.
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deerslayer9688 I'm a VIP Member of PAbucks.com!!
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nice buck moutaineer. good luck this season
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Stone
I'm a 12 point buck on this forum.
My next goal is to become a Member of the Pabucks.com Monster Buck Club.
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Cityhunter:
I am sure there are good deer numbers in some areas, especially urban areas. The problem is that areas that have survived on a hunting tradition are going out of business, hunters are going elsewhere, and multi-generation traditions are gone, never to be restored.......maybe recreated but never to be restored. And then some text book, game management, weenie tells all of us hunters that we don't know what we're looking at, or that we're seeing it wrong. It's a joke! |
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RSB I'm a VIP Member of PAbucks.com!!
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[quote]As far as the game warden on this site..well..Let me put it this way..he's the same GW that told me Bucks dont shed their velvet in August..It just goes to show how clueless the PGC is about the very game animnal they supposely are managing LOL..All i can do is laugh.[/quote]
That isn’t what I said and you know it. What I said was that a few bucks shed early but the majority don’t shed until the end of August and first week of September. Even your own pictures show that to be the time period when most bucks are shedding their velvet. You have a picture of one buck shedding his velvet on August 27th (which is within the last week of August by the way) and one picture taken on August 31 (the last day of August) with one buck in velvet and one out of velvet. It seems like the time frame I posted for bucks shedding their velvet are exactly the same as your pictures indicate. Dick Bodenhorn |
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Mountaineer I'm a VIP Member of PAbucks.com!!
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All Urban areas will have alot of deer and it will hold big mature bucks..Anytime you have a maze of protected land such as urban areas ..you can bet the hunting will be good..Pittsburgh/Phily areas will hold and grow big bucks..Im not going to disagree..If a hunter wants to hunt after quality bucks..get away from PGC land and get into the urban land.
My beef is..The very land our game managers own provides some of the poorest hunting...Is that a contradiction or what? Game managers land(PGC) = poor hunting...Thats crazy. Professionals??...LOL |
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RSB I'm a VIP Member of PAbucks.com!!
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[quote]It's not even about the size/quality of the bucks for me. Going to deer camp was a right of passage as a boy and very special camaraderie as a man. The current management practices have completely ruined that. In the ANF where it was just magical to be there in the dead of the winter hunting with your buddies and relatives, the camps sit empty now. We busted our butt the last 4-5 years and saw a grand total of a handful of deer, I think we killed 1 deer in 4 years, and that was shear luck.
The game wardens who administer this site keep trying to tell us we are all looking at it wrong........they are simply full of themselves. This is the first year since I got out of the service in 1979 that I have not bought a Pa. hunting license.[/quote] First of all I don’t administer this site, all I do is post here the same as you do. I certainly will agree though with the fact that the ANF has a lot fewer deer now than it once had. I don’t agree with the hunters that claim the reduction in deer came from hunters harvesting too many deer though. Hunter harvests are not the only thing that causes deer numbers to decline. Failing to take a look at the ENTIRE picture has frequently lead hunters to come to the total incorrect conclusions and that appears to be exactly where you are right now. First of all back in the 1980s and early 1990s the ANF was cutting about 64 million board feet of timber per year. Most of that resulted in extensive clear-cutting. As those clear-cuts regenerated they were supporting about 60-80 deer per square mile through the winter and even more than that through the summer and fall hunting season. That provided a lot of deer for hunters to both see and harvest. In the mid 1990s the Allegheny Defense Project (a misguided forest preservationist group made up mostly of collage students) were successful in getting a court injunction that stopped nearly all cutting on the ANF. During most of the couple decades that followed the ANF was been down to cutting two million board feet or less and most of that was salvage cutting of timber that was either blow down or dead. The affect of this moratorium of cutting meant that pretty much all of those clear-cut areas grew out of the reach of the deer and into pole timber with only supports about 3-7 deer per square mile through the winter and not many more than that during the summer or fall. With no new clear-cuts to sustain these once larger deer populations the deer numbers could do nothing but decline and simply couldn’t be sustained at the larger populations those once abundant clear-cuts used to support. The ANF and professional wildlife managers knew that was occurring but without the ability to do more cutting there was simply nothing they could do to correct the problem. They could either watch the deer numbers decline either through hunter harvests that exceeded fawn recruitment rates or watch the deer die from starvation. One of the two had to occur since the habitat changed to levels that absolutely couldn’t sustain the number of deer that once occurred. Now there is also a problem of extremely an invasive species (buckthorn) taking over large parts of the ANF, which might result in never allowing for regeneration of quality natural deer browse species again. The problems in the ANF are not from harvested too many deer, it is from not having harvested enough timber to regenerate enough deer food. Dick Bodenhorn |
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Mountaineer I'm a VIP Member of PAbucks.com!!
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Thanks DS...Good Luck to you
![[thumbup]](images/smiles/thumb.gif "thumbup") |
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Mountaineer I'm a VIP Member of PAbucks.com!!
Highest Ranked Member!!
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deerslayer9688 I'm a VIP Member of PAbucks.com!!
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moutaineer what kind cuddeback you using? The trigger speed is amazing. I have the cudde capture
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Stone
I'm a 12 point buck on this forum.
My next goal is to become a Member of the Pabucks.com Monster Buck Club.
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The problems in the ANF are not from harvested too many deer, it is from not having harvested enough timber to regenerate enough deer food.
Dick: The real problem in the ANF is that the PGC either didn't know what they were doing or weren't aware of what was happening in the ANF. Instead of wasting time telling us "we" are wrong the PGC should have been lobbying for what needed to be done, or planting what would be needed to overcome the logging industry's influence. The new deer hunting regulations did absolutely nothing to overcome the forestry influence! I remember not too long ago when the PGC said we could shoot multiple doe in one year.......was that done to counteract the forestry influence? Give me a break! We may not have leaned about hunting from a book but I'd say that we have a pretty good idea what is going on in the woods. |
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renegade Administrator
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RSB , don't pay him much attention. It's just ghosts, er.. I mean mountaineers little brother posting so he has someone to talk to.
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RSB I'm a VIP Member of PAbucks.com!!
Highest Ranked Member!!
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[quote="Stone"]The problems in the ANF are not from harvested too many deer, it is from not having harvested enough timber to regenerate enough deer food.
Dick: The real problem in the ANF is that the PGC either didn't know what they were doing or weren't aware of what was happening in the ANF. Instead of wasting time telling us "we" are wrong the PGC should have been lobbying for what needed to be done, or planting what would be needed to overcome the logging industry's influence. The new deer hunting regulations did absolutely nothing to overcome the forestry influence! I remember not too long ago when the PGC said we could shoot multiple doe in one year.......was that done to counteract the forestry influence? Give me a break! We may not have leaned about hunting from a book but I'd say that we have a pretty good idea what is going on in the woods.[/quote] Pretty much every professional resource management agency not only in this state but also in various parts of the country did come out in support of the ANF forest management plans and objectives. The judge that made the ruling simply didn’t care what anyone had to say and he shut the cutting down. Are you really suggesting that someone should have planted seedlings or some other food to maintain the deer populations those once clear-cut areas supported? If you are then I have to say that no you don’t know very much about what is or has been happening at all. To have planted enough seedlings in the ANF to replace what was lost with the halting of the cutting would require annually planting WAY more seedling then would be available in the entire world. First of all do you have any idea how many seedlings you would be talking about? Nature plants over a million per acre on nearly every acre of clear-cut each year. Who would come and do all of that hand planting even if there were that many commercial seedlings available in the world? Even if every man, woman and child in the state came to the ANF to plant trees every spring, they couldn’t keep up with what nature was already doing in those clear-cuts. Then without being able to make the cuts, remember the court stopped the cutting, just where do you think they should have planted all this deer food? What happened in the ANF is just an example of people forcing the professions into doing what they thought was better for the future, when in reality they had no idea what they were talking about or what the real affects were going to be. But, then hunters have been doing the very same thing for decades so it is kind of ironic that what the Allegheny Defense project did had a seriously adverse affect on the best interest of what the hunters wanted. Dick Bodenhorn |
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 | Stir the Pot! | |
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| Board Index » What Can We Do? | The time now is Fri May 24, 2013 2:27 am |
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